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Collection of BIM related standards

  1. F by furtonb on 5 Dec 2020, edited 7 Dec 2020 #

    Dear Community,

    maybe I am still getting used to this forum interface, but I couldn't find an entry where BIM related standards would be collected - not a discussion thread nor a wiki article. I'm having like these in mind:

    ISO 19650-1:2018: Organization and digitization of information about buildings and blah blah...

    ISO 16739-1:2018: Industry Foundation Classes... you get the idea.

    Is it done so far? If so, please direct me there. If it isn't - would you be interested? (I also think having an overview internationally/continentally/nationally would be beneficial.)

    (In the latest BIMvoice video about IFC classes Dion and Petru touch the subject a little:)

  2. D by duncan on 5 Dec 2020 #
  3. F by furtonb on 5 Dec 2020 #

    I know it isn't open, unfortunately. But it is a necessary source of knowledge, which is important to at least know about. In this sense neither the ISO 16739 itself nor ISO 12006 is "open", I cannot just download it and see what's inside, although it is about necessary information - although IFC is an open standard. The PAS 1192 standard is available for download on the other hand, it served as the basis of 19650, if I'm not mistaken.

    I disagree about listing only open standards, I think it is necessary to have at least a vague idea what standards might be relevant in practice - although I wholeheartedly agree with your summary about the 19650 here in this comment section, especially this part:

    In my view it's a scandal that I can read ISO 19650 because I work in a large firm who buys access, while many small and medium size firms don't even have access to this "standard". I'm not at all comfortable calling anything a standard when it behind a paywall - but maybe that's just me.

    No, it's not just you. But listing only open standards is like partially explaining something, and among the first steps toward a more open construction industry would be to gather all the currently proprietary (is this word applicable for paid standards?) standards too, at least to have an idea how much of the "standardised" workflow is behind paywalls. It would be good for assessment - at least I know that I don't know what standards are "applicable" to BIM, there isn't a single source of information to go and check, "hey, I'm into this field, what do I need to know about not to burn myself completely". I would be absolutely among the happiest if all the necessary knowledge would be available in an open way, but right now, unfortunately, this isn't the case.

    Creating a built environment with free software, increased transparency, and a more ethical approach

    In my view having a collection of standards used in practice doesn't contradict this statement - on the contrary, it is a necessary step. The Designing Buildings site has a collection here, but it doesn't look like a comprehensive summary and focuses only on the UK.

  4. J by JanF on 5 Dec 2020, edited 5 Dec 2020 #

    @duncan I recently read about pdf ISO 32000-2:2017 which is considered free and open, even though you have to pay just to look at it. Is that what you mean or are there really some ISO standards you aren't allowed to get even if you are willing to pay the price?

    Edit: that would mean they are not free right? And you mean some of them are not open as in they are defined by a single company and not by public vote?

  5. D by duncan on 7 Dec 2020, edited 15 Apr 2022 #

    Some ISO standard are open as IFC is open. It is an ISO standard and it is freely available.

    Some ISO standards are standards but you are not free to implement them as they describe proprietary solutions. I am currently having this discussion with our ministry of housing who mandate the use of ISO signage for building sites without in any way making accommodation for the fact that the images used in ISO standards are copyrighted by ISO. I hadn't thought about this problem until very recently. Typically people just ignore this.

    An example seems to also be STEP files https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_10303-21 look under criticism - but I don't know the details of why it is called proprietary @Moult you sent me down that rabbit hole maybe you know why?

    @furtonb I think we need to remember in this project that it is not the 'Learn absolutely everything about BIM' project. We want to focus on OpenBIM and the solutions related to that. So I would like us to think about whether we are focusing our time appropriately.

  6. F by furtonb on 7 Dec 2020 #

    @duncan fair enough.

    (to clarify, my intention was not to put the standards themselves - but a collection of the titles and a description of the related area, why it's important to know about.)

    summarizing the ones that are applicable to everyone whether it's openBIM or proprietary technology is a good idea, but I have no clue where to draw the line (I mean when can the ISO say it's publication of restricted material).

  7. M by magicalcloud_75 on 7 Dec 2020 #

    I read this in the list of definitions: "Information - valuable data". In the Netherlands we say "daar zakt mijn broek van af.."my pants fall to the groud. Stopped reading anything.

  8. F by furtonb on 7 Dec 2020 #

    I read this in the list of definitions: "Information - valuable data"

    @magicalcloud_75 where did you read this?

  9. M by magicalcloud_75 on 7 Dec 2020, edited 7 Dec 2020 #

    "Meaningful data"

    I am or academic scientist but this is one hell of a super shortcut to avoid any hard question that might araise.

    Meaningful just does not cover the I of the bim concept. The B is highly questionable, the M always was. model / -management / information manament ? And now the I is also.

    https://www.nen.nl/norm/pdf/preview/document/277555/

  10. D by duncan on 7 Dec 2020 #

    @furtonb just to be clear it's not my intention to discourage what could be an interesting addition to the wiki. That's none of my business. We also describe proprietary software and file formats here since they can't always be avoided.

    On this page we've made clear what is open access and what is not. Maybe if you add more standards you could do something similar?

    https://wiki.osarch.org/index.php?title=Standards_organizations

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